Edibles for Chronic Pain: A Delicious Solution to a Debilitating Problem

Cathy: I was injured years ago on a job, and unfortunately, it led to surgery on my back. I have some fusions in my spine, and I used to use cannabis recreationally years ago, and the pain is just; it can be debilitating. With meds, you can only take so much to where it makes you tired. It messes with your digestive system, you know, the side effects. I decided to start doing edibles, and I had never tried edibles before, but I had heard a lot about them. I went to one of the local dispensaries here, and I purchased some items; some worked really well, and I enjoyed them.

Cathy: They gave me a different feeling from smoking cannabis. It’s more of a physical, and it eliminates my pain. It helps me to sleep better at night. I also deal with arthritis, I have it really bad in my hands, and that helps. It helps with the inflammation, the pain, just being able to do things that normally it’d be like, “Okay, well, I got to wait till that mellows out.” I have found a positive way to use cannabis in my life.

Emily: I’m so happy for you. Pain relief, everybody deserves that, and everybody deserves to feel better. Did you have a transition time when you transitioned from pharmaceuticals to cannabis? How did that evolve for you?

Cathy: I was doing a combination starting out because I didn’t know how cannabis would be. You have to learn your dosage for one. You can’t just jump into and eat the whole thing and go, “Oh, I’ll be fine.” You’ve got to take it in small bites, literally, to see how your body would respond and to see how well it works with your body.

Cathy: Then learn the different types of cannabis as well because each one works a little bit differently. That’s where I got started. I started with a brownie bite. I can’t remember the name of them, but I recognize them when I see them. The brownie is the reason why I started making my own that the brownie that I ate, it worked, but it was more like cardboard. I was looking more for flavor, but also have it work as well. So I started my journey of making my own.

Emily: That is so exciting. That’s a brave step to get ready and experiment. What made you say, “Let me step out of my comfort zone of the dispensary and move into the world of edibles?” At home, I should say.

Cathy: One, I can control what goes in it. I know where the product comes from, and then I can adjust it to my taste as well. It’s a combination of things. I can adjust the dosage because sometimes I might need something a little bit stronger, and sometimes not so strong. What you buy at a dispensary, it’s hard to tell exactly. “Okay, is this exactly what I need or want, you know?” I decided to start doing my own thing, and I am educating myself, and I’m getting ready to take a class soon about all the cannabis parts tried and true recipes from a world-renowned chef that has done it for years.

Emily: In most cases, it’s actually not the truth. Everybody that I’ve talked to they echo the same message. I’m not here to get high, not that there’s anything wrong with getting high, because if you enjoy it, go for it. But everybody’s intention is to feel better. I’m so glad we have these conversations to continue to squash that stereotype because it’s just so false.

Cathy: It’s very much needed. I agree. I think the more education and understanding people have, the more they’ll stop and think, “Well, maybe I’ve been looking at this wrong; maybe this can help people with depression and these types of things.” They start seeing things differently. I believe that it can help people with depression and anxiety and pain and other issues that they might have, you know, they’ve been using cannabis for cancer patients for how long, you know, to get them to eat.

Cathy: I went with my husband, and it was interesting because, of course, you have to show your ID to show that you’re of legal age. We got there, and he knows a lot more about it than I do; I’m also learning from him as well. I was asking him questions, and he was showing me different products, knowing that I prefer edibles. He introduced me to a lemonade, and he can drink the whole bottle with no problem. I take it, and I’ll sip on it. I’ll take a little bit at night before I go to bed and put the rest in the fridge. He goes, you’re a lightweight. I said that’s okay. I don’t mind being a lightweight.

Emily: That sounds so exciting because I have not seen products like that available here in New York. For someone to hear that you could get a lemonade is so, it’s so exciting.

Cathy: Oh, yes. They have lots of new products out up here. Lemonade, tinctures, and ointments that you can use. There’s taffy and brownies and cookies. My thought process, I would like to get it more towards savory things or like granola. Different things that you don’t see in the market. Eventually, I would like to be at that point where some of these things I could market. Butter is very common, I always got a gallon jar of it in my fridge, and it’s in there.

Cathy: I was cooking with it one day, and I asked my husband; I said, well, what do you think? He goes, it tastes really good. I said, “Well, I used some of the cannabutter in it. He’s like, no wonder it tastes so good, you know? I was experimenting one day, and I decided to make fudge with cannabutter. Unfortunately, I have an issue with my one arm, so I couldn’t beat it to the thickness it needed to lose that gloss.

Cathy: So I converted it to an ice cream topping. I had already made brownie bites for New Year’s Eve, so we had some remaining, and he had come home to see me eat this one night. I had taken a couple of brownie bites and then some vanilla bean ice cream, and then some of the canna-fudge topping. I was eating, he goes, “I want to try some.” I said, do you want me to make you some now? He goes, no, I just ate. He said, let’s wait till tomorrow. So I was like, okay.

Cathy: He got home the next night, and I was like, you ready for your dessert? I asked him how many brownies he wanted and how much ice cream. I got it exactly the way he liked it. He sat down and was eating it, and he only had about four bites in, maybe five, and he goes, “I’m getting high already.” He cleaned the bowl. He said, “Babe, that was awesome. That fudge topping. Oh, my goodness. With the brownies and the ice cream. Yes.” I gave you a friend of mine some of the fudge toppings, and he loved it. He was like, that is so good. I’m experimenting with things and finding different things to do besides just the brownies that everybody wants and talks about. I consider that a staple.

Cathy: I like to find alternative substances that I can use with the cannabis and create something new. I think the more we experiment with cannabis, the more we’re going to find products that it’s not always sweets. There are a lot of people out here with type one, type two diabetes, or pre-diabetic, which makes it harder for them with the sugars and that type of thing. I’m looking to infuse maple syrup because I want to use that on my granola.

Cathy: It is. I believe that when you cook for someone, you show your love and the care that you have for people. People, if they stop and look at it, we connect when we break bread together; it can be your friends, your family, and it can be a business as well, which is where I’m hoping to go into with it. I’m really excited about this because it’s, it’s opened a whole new world for cooking.

Emily: That is so exciting. When you make a meal for someone, infused or not, you’re sharing and showing your love, but then add the cannabis component on top of it, and you’re adding in healing and well-being; it is the perfect marriage.

Cathy: It is. I just recently found a place where I can get cannabis raw for CBD. That is something I am going to be exploring more. I’m excited about it because CBD helps me physically as well. I would like to get to the point where my business when I start really growing it, I can do the cannabis and then tone it down with the CBD.

Emily: Oh, that is perfect. That’s so good to mention, too, because a lot of people assume it’s just THC. But there’s CBD, and there are so many other cannabinoids, and just because they don’t “make us high” doesn’t mean they can’t make us feel well in other situations. What do you like to use CBD for?

Cathy: Really? Wow. Yeah, it was great. She goes, “I’m going to take you to get coffee” because I was hurting really bad that day, wintertime and stuff. I was like, okay, so we went and got coffee, and she said, told them how much she wanted in each cup. They were like, no problem. I started drinking it. It was like, “Oh wow, this is amazing.” I learned something new that day; I was introduced to a new product, but being able to blend it was something else. I could drink it while I’m out. I don’t like to eat edibles and be driving. I prefer to stay home, be safe. The CBD I can take it without having that worry, so it makes a big difference.

Emily: I know, but there’s something special about going out with a friend and a friend introducing you. Imagine how easy it would be for people to be introduced to cannabis if a friend could just take them on a coffee date, introduce them, and order for them. It sounds so romantic and, not in a romantic way, but what a great way to introduce someone to cannabis. It’s safe; it’s comfortable. You’re with a friend.

Cathy: It was, it was. And you know, I hope more people realize that just because it comes from cannabis does not mean it’s a bad thing. It doesn’t make you high; it doesn’t give you that body high or mental high. It helps ease the pain. I love CBD, and you can get it in cream forms or ointment forms now, too. A lot of people don’t realize that, so I hope from this podcast and others that I know you’re doing, I hope others realize there’s more to cannabis than just a recreational high. And our society needs it. The pharma companies are poisoning us with the meds. Occasionally I still have to take them, but I limit myself.

Emily: Definitely. If people feel like they can’t find those things and cannabis could be an answer, I really hope people really give it a chance because it’s made a difference for me. It’s made a difference for you. And we’re just regular real people trying to show everyone else that there is a really great alternative out there.

Cathy: Definitely; now, what differences do you see between smoking cannabis and edibles? I mean, you’ve got experience with it. I would like to hear your point of view and your journey.

Emily: I will preface by saying I love smoking. It is my favorite avenue. I think that stems from when I first started using cannabis over 10 years ago. That’s all there was. I didn’t know anything about edibles, really. It was just you roll a blunt, you smoke a pipe, that’s it. That was my, always my first and only introduction to cannabis. As I’ve learned and as I became a mom, I really wanted to smoke less because I hate smelling like it. My big thing is smelling like it. It’s always bothered me because I don’t want people to smell me. I don’t want my kids to smell me. It would tip people off that I could be a cannabis consumer.

Cathy: Right.

Emily: That has been the perfect medium of “Okay, you can have your cake and eat it too.” You can have that instantaneous relief without having to worry about the negatives associated with smoking. I’ve played around with a couple of different devices. There are tons out there, and I think that people, anyone listening, has to know that there’s like a little learning curve. You have to be patient and willing to work with it. But once you figure it out, for me, I hardly smoke at all anymore unless it’s a social thing.

Emily: But at home, I can use my dry herb vaporizer, it doesn’t smell, and I don’t have to worry so much about my kids. I can still smoke, but I have fallen in love with edibles. Once they came on the scene, at first, I was like, “I don’t like edibles” because I didn’t know my dosage. I was always really nervous about it. Once there were products with dosages on them, not just like a baggie from a friend with a random brownie inside, like once I was like, “Okay, I know if I take this, this has five milligrams” I could track my dose and understand what my body needed.

Cathy: I test it that way. That’s the best you can do until you can figure it out. If you make your recipe the same every time, and then you take individual small bite sizes, not a big bite size. Now my husband always wants a big bite size. I’m like a third of what he does. But until you get the idea and understanding of what your body needs and how much you can take and stay in that parameter, then you’re good. Until that point, you have to experiment and find out, you know, okay, where am I at? Because one dosage for you might not be enough for me, or vice versa.

Cathy: Right, and you need to give time to let it affect you. I knew somebody that had a brownie, and it was a regular-sized brownie. I said, “Do not eat the whole thing. Take a little bit off, eat it, wait a half hour or so, 45 minutes an hour, depending on your body, and see how it goes.” My concern is their safety and not being sick. I want them to feel good and know that they’re safe. Because when they don’t do it properly, a lot of people tend to panic, and they don’t feel safe.

Emily: It’s true, and it’s like you hear all these news stories of rises in ER visits after cannabis has been legalized, and it’s just the people eating too many edibles and having a really hard reaction to it. You’re not going to die, but at the moment, it actually does feel like you’re going to die. The whole goal of education and using cannabis responsibly is teaching people, “If you’re going to try this, you can do it responsibly.” We don’t have to eat the whole thing. I’m so glad you’re saying this because that’s how we act as responsible cannabis consumers.

Cathy: That’s right, and people need to understand it may taste good, and that’s why you want to eat more. But just because you want to eat more doesn’t make it act faster.

Emily: Right, and we’re all so different. I mentioned I like smoking because it works fast, whereas edibles will take much longer to take effect, but it’s still different for everyone. It could take 30 minutes; it could take two hours. It can depend on your digestive system, what you’ve eaten for the day, and other medications. With edibles, it really is about patience. I know that’s hard for people. I find a lot of times; people still have that pharma mindset where they’re like, “Just give me the pill, give me the solution, give me the single dose.” They’re not used to having to experiment and be patient. That feels awkward for people. But I like to assure people that’s the journey.

Cathy: Yes. I was watching a show about chefs that use cannabis in their cooking, and I’m not going to name it, but they were doing a contest, and the chef had to put so much in. They had to let them know what was in there, the host and the hostess. Then they had a panel of people that they invited to try it out, and they were talking about don’t eat everything if you are not used to it; take small bites. They didn’t serve massive amounts when they did it. They would do smaller bites and say, “Hey, there’s three grams in there total, so if you are not used to it, take only a bite.”

Cathy: See how it goes. I mean, they even talked about it on the show. People need to be aware that we’re not doing this to tell them what to do. We’re telling you this for your own safety, you know, your own well-being.

Emily: I feel like we’re trying to share wisdom with others. I feel like our parents, most of them teach us how to drink responsibly, but we don’t really have anyone to teach us how to use cannabis responsibly. It’s kind of like a PSA, like woman-to-woman or adults-to-adult, “Hello, we’re just trying to help you.” We’re not trying to tell anybody what to do but just offer that guidance and reassurance. I think a lot of people who are scared to take edibles might actually just love this conversation because they know that they can baby step it, and that’s the right thing to do.

Cathy: Yes, that’s how I did it. I baby stepped because you got to have a healthy fear of knowing what your body can handle. That’s with anything.

Emily: True.

Cathy: Even pharmaceuticals. So if they’re like, okay, a cancer patient, they don’t automatically put them on 50 milligrams of morphine, they small dose it until they find out what works. Cannabis is the same way. You have to have a healthy respect for the plant and what it can do for you. That is what people don’t think about, unfortunately.

Emily: Oh, absolutely. And I have a feeling a lot of people are going to listen to this and be like, oh this, I mean, my hope is that someone out there who maybe hasn’t tried cannabis before is going to listen to Cathy and be like, “Wow, you know, she didn’t do cannabis before, and I don’t want to smoke, but I could try an edible. And she just told me how to do it safely.” It’s perfect; it’s a win-win because I feel like anyone who uses cannabis and feels so much better, just want to help someone else. By sharing your experience and your story, you are helping other people. So thank you so much.

Cathy: Oh, you are so welcome. I wanted to put it out there that I am in my late 50s. I am not a young girl running around doing this. I wanted to break the age barrier. For women or men that are older, you can use cannabis, and you can use it safely and give it a shot. During my timeframe, my era, it was taboo for a lot of years. We were always told, “oh, well, if you’re doing that, you’re bad. You’re on the wrong side of the track, so to speak.” And it’s not bad; it’s a plant. You have to use your brain when you’re starting out; use your common sense.

Cathy: Just because I’m of an age doesn’t mean that you won’t get relief from it. Just do it responsibly. Try it; it might work for you. If you try it and it didn’t, well, go back to what you were doing before. You know, I’m sorry it didn’t work for you, but open yourself up to it. Think about it, check it out, do a little reading, educate yourself. I don’t want people my age to be afraid of using cannabis for pain, arthritis, anxiety, depression, or whatever the case may be. Younger people are more open most times. A lot of people my age are somewhat closed off. I’m hoping this helps them to understand that it’s not just the younger generation that can get some relief. They could get some relief as well.

Emily: I’m so glad you shared that because our older generation, I’m finding, are the ones that are most in need of cannabis, most interested in cannabis, and most ready to use cannabis. I hope your words echo out into the ears of anybody who is of a certain generation who is waiting. I think those are the best words you can offer them. Just give it a try and see what happens.

Cathy: My daughter wants to come home and help be a part of the business. I’m hoping that’ll work out in the next year or so. So, my husband, of course, supports me. I’ve got some friends that support me. And so, the journey with my children and having open communication about everything, including cannabis.

Cathy: Oh my goodness. Restrictive movements. A lot of pain with the infusions, with the fusions in my back, my arthritis. I’ve had a knee replaced. I played a lot of ball growing up and blew out my knee, so I had to get it replaced. I would be dealing with a lot of pain and a lot of limitations in my life. I’m more active knowing I have relief than if I didn’t. And the medication, pharma medication, can cause depression. Just not wanting to be around people. Pain already makes you tired, and the medication can make you doubly tired. I prefer to limit that as much as possible and use something more natural. Cannabis, CBD at home, and be able to function and get some relief from that pain.

Emily: Oh my God, I’m so glad you found cannabis. I mean, I just am so happy for you. Suppose you could go back 10, 20, or 30 years ago and give yourself just a little piece of cannabis advice. What would it be?

Cathy: I would tell myself to change and start using it in my cooking. Unlike you, when I had children, I quit smoking cannabis because you want the best for your children. You want them healthy. It’s there, but there’s time for that down the road. It wasn’t regulated back then, either. That’s a big thing to me. If I had found edibles or the possibility of edibles, I think that would be the main thing. Learning how to cook and doing edibles ease a lot of the pain physically that I have been through.

Emily: I’m so glad you found cannabis when you did. I always ask this question, we look back, but you know, hindsight is always 20/20. Pathways lead us to where we’re supposed to be. Our last question, and I’d love for you to tie this in with your new business and talk a little bit about that, but what would you like to be most remembered for in the cannabis phase?

Cathy: I would like to be remembered, I don’t want to say mature, but as someone from another generation that has opened their mind to what cannabis can do, what cannabis can do for everyone, if they open their mind to it, and of course educate themselves, that’s the priority. You have to educate yourself. Don’t just go out there and do it. I hope to leave a legacy of edibles and the thought that you can experiment and take a chance, not just with edibles but with different types of recipes and different products to use cannabis with. Find out what works for you. That’s what I’m basing my edibles on.

Cathy: Right now, I am just doing it by word of mouth. People ask me, “Hey, do you have some butter?” Or “Would you make me some brownies?” Or even asking me, what do you do with your cannabis? How do you incorporate it? And the oil is a basic, the butter is a basic, to me, the brownies are a basic, they’ve been around forever. But like the ice cream, the fudge for the ice cream, I don’t know of anybody that’s done that. Nobody’s done the granola that I know of. These are things that I want everybody to realize they can do. Explore, experiment, but just be safe with it.

Emily: When you get your website up and running, let me know, and I will link it so anybody who listens to this podcast episode can find you and find. I’m going to need some fudge for my ice cream in the future. I’ve like literally been thinking about it this whole interview. “Oh, it sounds so amazing.” For anybody who wants to keep up with you, I’ll make sure to get your information in there so they can stay in touch.